Jump to content


Photo

New joystick


  • Please log in to reply
21 replies to this topic

#1 Pragr

Pragr

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 298 posts

Posted 02 February 2018 - 09:37 AM

My current joystick (Cobra M5 Defender) is about to go to the silicon heaven. The spring holding the stick in neutral position gave it up yesterday during evasive moves when P-40 bounced me while I was escorting Etzel's Heinkel. The stick is working in fact but with no centering force I have to hold it in the neutral position by myself. The most hilarious consequence is that I was able to shot down that attacking P-40 anyway and made perfect landing on home airfield (I don't even remember when I made such perfect three-point landing with no bounce in Bf 109 :) ). So I'm absolutely in for Saturday FiF. I suppose the weekend will be fun as hell :D

 

Anyway there's my new joystick that should arrive on Monday:

 

Ravcore-Javelin-2.jpg

 

If it looks familiar to you then you're right. It is the replica of KG12 control stick used in Bf 109 and Fw 190.


  • Klaiber, Hess, Lipfert and 1 other like this
Posted Image

#2 Pfeil

Pfeil

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 138 posts
  • LocationJasta 6

Posted 02 February 2018 - 11:35 AM

VKB Gladiator?


iGKzmH7.jpg


#3 Etzel

Etzel

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 201 posts

Posted 02 February 2018 - 12:08 PM

That performance was awesome, Pragr, was a cool mission we had yesterday!  :D

 

I am also curious what Joystick the new one is and what you report about it then... My beloved X52 pro will sooner or later also reach the end of it's life cycle...  :rolleyes:



#4 Baron

Baron

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 543 posts

Posted 02 February 2018 - 12:24 PM

Nice joy :)


TmuSTM.png

1kQMDa.png


#5 Pragr

Pragr

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 298 posts

Posted 02 February 2018 - 12:38 PM

VKB Gladiator?

 

Yes it is. It's just made by different manufacturer since the original one didn't get some license because it's Thaiwan company or something like this :)


Posted Image

#6 Pragr

Pragr

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 298 posts

Posted 02 February 2018 - 12:48 PM

That performance was awesome, Pragr, was a cool mission we had yesterday!  :D

 

I am also curious what Joystick the new one is and what you report about it then... My beloved X52 pro will sooner or later also reach the end of it's life cycle...  :rolleyes:

 

I destroyed at least three sets of Saitek X52Pro in my virtual pilot career. It is great set and I loved to use the thumb ministick for looking around. But the interconnecting PS2 cable drove me crazy for too long :) Now I'm using the Thrustmaster TWCS throttle:

 

https://www.czc.cz/t...ASABEgJW_PD_BwE

 

and hopefully the new control stick would be as good as the TWCS. Both actually cost about 65 Euros each so the overall price is about 2/3 of Saitek X52 Pro set (based on amazon.de's prices).


Posted Image

#7 Pfeil

Pfeil

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 138 posts
  • LocationJasta 6

Posted 02 February 2018 - 01:04 PM

My G940 had problems with motors overheating and cables so I bought this 3 weeks ago, 

No regrets.

 

HotasWarthog800x600.jpg


  • Klaiber, Lipfert and HotleadColdfeet like this

iGKzmH7.jpg


#8 Luftritter

Luftritter

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,754 posts
  • LocationMichigan, United States

Posted 02 February 2018 - 01:57 PM

Sure am glad you guys will all be there! Those are some fine joysticks you guys have!

"People who believe they are ignorant of nothing have neither looked for, nor stumbled upon, the boundary between what is known and unknown in the universe."  -Neil deGrasse Tyson


#9 Britchot

Britchot

    Advanced Member

  • Administrators
  • 4,279 posts
  • LocationLancaster, CA

Posted 02 February 2018 - 02:38 PM

I’m jealous of the KG-12 stick. If someone made one that can plug into a TM Warthog base, I would probably buy one :)

Britchot_R_tiny.png?dl=0

Britchot_O_tiny.png?dl=0

Britchot_FS_tiny.png?dl=0

   "Es ist noch ein Meister vom Himmel gefallen."


#10 Pfeil

Pfeil

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 138 posts
  • LocationJasta 6

Posted 02 February 2018 - 02:49 PM

They are

https://vkbcontrolle...-for-gunfighter

 

And you can buy only the grip.

https://vkbcontrolle...v-b-kg12-series

 

Update:

Ok no they are not. That adapter is to attach warthog grip on VKB base not vice versa. 


iGKzmH7.jpg


#11 Britchot

Britchot

    Advanced Member

  • Administrators
  • 4,279 posts
  • LocationLancaster, CA

Posted 02 February 2018 - 03:26 PM

Yeah, I had thought they were for the TM base at first, too.  


Britchot_R_tiny.png?dl=0

Britchot_O_tiny.png?dl=0

Britchot_FS_tiny.png?dl=0

   "Es ist noch ein Meister vom Himmel gefallen."


#12 Luftritter

Luftritter

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,754 posts
  • LocationMichigan, United States

Posted 02 February 2018 - 05:16 PM

Got me looking, VKB "Gunfighter Pro MK.II"

 

WOW!!     :lol:   WOW!  WOW!!

 

Stick extension and everything!  The button configuration is a lot more what looks like I'd want....but it's hard to tell exactly what they are (I prefer 4-way hats to 8-way hats).

 

Awesome Joystick

 

This is looking mighty interesting for the not too distant future!  Thanks guys!!

 

VKB_MCG-Pro_GFPro_01.jpg


"People who believe they are ignorant of nothing have neither looked for, nor stumbled upon, the boundary between what is known and unknown in the universe."  -Neil deGrasse Tyson


#13 Luftritter

Luftritter

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,754 posts
  • LocationMichigan, United States

Posted 02 May 2018 - 02:27 PM

Thought this deserved to be revisited.  Anybody know what happened to this company (VKB) ?  They seem to have few if any of their products actually available to purchase anymore.

 

@ Loopy, I remember when we talked and you had found another European company that made very high quality joysticks; but I can't remember the name of that other company.  Do you recall it, and do you know if they're still viable?  S!


"People who believe they are ignorant of nothing have neither looked for, nor stumbled upon, the boundary between what is known and unknown in the universe."  -Neil deGrasse Tyson


#14 Shadepiece

Shadepiece

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 120 posts
  • LocationThe Rockies

Posted 02 May 2018 - 03:26 PM

VKB is actually killing it tight now, but from what I hwar they only sell in waves. They can't keep up with production, so they sell out immediately. They did, according to their Facebook page, just buy a new manufacturing wearhouse which is exciting! I really want one of those Gunfighters!
  • Lipfert likes this
Fire only at close range, and only when your opponent is properly in your sights.

-Hauptmann Oswald Boelcke, Jasta 2

#15 Vonrd

Vonrd

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,477 posts
  • LocationOakland, CA

Posted 02 May 2018 - 04:09 PM

Virpil is the other anufacturer. I'm seriously considering.

https://virpil.com/en/


Posted ImagePosted Image

#16 Luftritter

Luftritter

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,754 posts
  • LocationMichigan, United States

Posted 03 May 2018 - 01:58 PM

Virpil is the other anufacturer. I'm seriously considering.

https://virpil.com/en/

 

That's the one I was asking Loopy about!  Thanks!

 

Sounds and looks awesome, but mounting would be a problem.  The desk mount bracket they sell looks monstrous and I can't see how that wouldn't get in the way of your legs.  It bugs me that the pictures they have of it have no scale at all, so it could be any size; and none of the pictures show it mounted to a desk, and there's no dimensions at all given.

 

I thing I could figure out how to flush mount it in what I have by cutting a hole and letting it protrude through the underside, but it would take some work.

 

If VKB has nothing available the next time their availability date comes around in a couple of weeks, I'll get one of these.

 

Thanks again!


"People who believe they are ignorant of nothing have neither looked for, nor stumbled upon, the boundary between what is known and unknown in the universe."  -Neil deGrasse Tyson


#17 Vonrd

Vonrd

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,477 posts
  • LocationOakland, CA

Posted 03 May 2018 - 03:22 PM

Here's a YT review which may be helpful:


  • Luftritter likes this
Posted ImagePosted Image

#18 Luftritter

Luftritter

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,754 posts
  • LocationMichigan, United States

Posted 03 May 2018 - 10:44 PM

Well that's just awesome, thanks!

 

I can see now that those mounts are made for the long shaft extensions; that makes a lot more sense....to use one for a short shaft would be kind of a waste.

 

My biggest concern about the mount is that it puts the stick far out from the mounting surface.  That would mean that I would have to have a far reach to my throttle quadrant with my left hand, and the stick would be much nearer to me for my right.

 

The solution would be to get two of the mounts, and use one for the quadrant.  The mount fits their own throttle and they have adapter plates for others, like the Warthog throttle.  However, none of those are multi-axis quadrants, and I've really grown used to having that feature.  I think I could gin up an adapter plate for what I have pretty easily.

 

One very interesting item of interest between the two sticks is that the VKB has 20 degrees of movement, and the Virpil has 15.  Theoretically, this would make the VKB more accurate in control.  However, with the stick extension, 20 degrees of movement might seem excessive.  Here's my take on it:  You can always reduce the amount of degrees that it takes to get to 100% by creating a dead zone of any size you want, at the end of any axis.  However, you can't make one larger.  In my opinion, the whole idea of using a stick extension would be to eliminate the need for response curves at all, since the stick is (nearly) the same length as the original in the real airplane.

 

The Virpil also comes with 3 different spring sets, so the weak spring symptom this guy had with the VKB would seem very unlikely.  He does make a big thing out of the adjust-on-the-fly feature the Virpil has; however, that's just a fine adjustment.  The really good feature is the changeable springs and the fact that it comes with them (as well as 3 different centering cams).

 

It's all a moot point if you can't actually purchase a VKB though; and I have an idea that 15 degrees would be pretty practical with the stick extension; and with the Virpil, you can not only get 3 different lengths, I'm thinking you might also be able to gang two or more together.  In terms of accuracy, what matters in the end is how far the stick travels at the top where the grip is.  If that's the case, you could get the same amount of travel just by lengthening the extension and lowering the base.

 

Interesting!  Exciting!

 

Thanks!


"People who believe they are ignorant of nothing have neither looked for, nor stumbled upon, the boundary between what is known and unknown in the universe."  -Neil deGrasse Tyson


#19 Schäfer

Schäfer

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 68 posts
  • LocationMelbourne, Australia

Posted 05 May 2018 - 03:12 AM

I have moved on from my Logitech to the CH which is a vast improvement. I am now looking at the VKB Gladiator and yes it is really hard to come by. 


albatros_dv_jasta_6_1_by_ws_clave-d4wlgn


#20 Luftritter

Luftritter

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,754 posts
  • LocationMichigan, United States

Posted 05 May 2018 - 02:20 PM

You can see in Vonrd's video that the mounting device is positioned in the middle of the pedals (your legs would go around it).  The other mount is off to the side of his left leg.  I still kind of wonder if that would interfere with your legs at all.  That would get irritating.

 

I've been checking what I've got right now, and the stick is mounted right above my right leg on top of the keyboard tray.  It is mounted off center to the right, almost in line with my right hand.  The throttle quadrant is mounted in front of my left hand.  When I move my pedals, my legs are very close to the bottom of the keyboard tray; they almost touch it.  So, I don't thing buying the Virpil without an extension on it would work, even if I flush-mounted it in the keyboard tray; too much of it would protrude below.

 

Even sticks that offer a surface mount plate version, like the VKB or TM Warthog, still stick up quite a way due to the gimbal; and the footprint of the plate they sit on is pretty big.  No matter what, it's going to be significantly different than what I have now.

 

It's hard to envision the best solution.


"People who believe they are ignorant of nothing have neither looked for, nor stumbled upon, the boundary between what is known and unknown in the universe."  -Neil deGrasse Tyson





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users